Varroa Monitoring New Product

[Bakersdozen]

Varroa "Easy Check" by Veto-pharma.
http://www.veto-pharma.com/products/varroa-control/varroa-easycheck/
This product is supposed to give an accurate mite count without too much hassle.  It is certainly less dangerous than doing an alcohol wash with a lit smoker nearby. 
Dadant sells this device for $19.95. 
I believe I will stick with the sugar roll method.  Our recommendations, in this area, for treating are so low that I think the sugar roll method is sufficient for me.  It's basically the same steps and I have misgivings about killing 300 bees. 
What does everyone else think?

[Perry]

I use one of these.
https://www.countryfields.ca/products/bee-shaker
When I did inspections for the province I had to use alcohol (windshield washer fluid), but don't anymore.

[LazyBkpr]

Welll..... I don't claim it is right, but I more or less stopped checking for mites after the first two years of using OAV. I treat when I am supposed to and just don't have mite problems anymore.
   I would like to say if I see a hive in trouble I can check and treat... but I have never had to do that.

[riverbee]

if i check for mites i do use the sugar roll method,  the university of minnesota has the kit for 20 bucks: (developed by marla spivak):

Bee Squad Varroa Mite Testing Kit

[efmesch]

Notice how the video doesn't mention how to get rid of the bees after they have been bathed in alcohol and checked for mites.  One would almost think that they get up and crawl back into the hive and rejoin the family to carry on as if nothing happened. A loss of 300 bees early in the season might  set the hive back as it tries to build up.

I subscribe to LazyBkprs suggestion. 

[Wandering Man]

Notice how the video doesn't mention how to get rid of the bees after they have been bathed in alcohol and checked for mites.  One would almost think that they get up and crawl back into the hive and rejoin the family to carry on as if nothing happened. A loss of 300 bees early in the season might  set the hive back as it tries to build up.

I subscribe to LazyBkprs suggestion.

That makes me feel better.  I have a problem collecting bees and killing them.

[riverbee]

i have done the alcohol wash............

if one wants to check mite loads, try the sugar roll method, doesn't harm or kill bees.

i rarely treat. i don't use the OAV method.  i keep russians so very mite resistant, and i don't treat blindly...... 'treat because' .....or without 'evidence' of a mite problem.

if i use anything on my bees, it would be a thymol based product. that's just me, that's just my practice.

[LazyBkpr]

 i don't treat blindly...... 'treat because' .....or without 'evidence' of a mite problem.


   Ouch... shot through the heart!
    So let me explain my own philosophy?
   All bees have a mite problem unless your in Australia. Some of them have it worse than others.... Some of them are resistant and may not need to be treated. MOST of my hives do not have the resistance to cope with the mites, so I KNOW they will have problems if not treated.
     I treat regularly because checking 80+ hives for mites would take longer than actually treating them does. Blindly is not how I would put it exactly. Spring treatments are meant to help get them started by reducing the mite load. Fall treatments are also to insure a low mite load, so that the bees caring for the bees that will care for the bees that go into winter will be as strong and healthy as possible. So even if my bees are not "AT" that threshold where they need to be treated, i still subscribe to reducing the number of mites as much as possible, so that they will be as healthy as possible.
   Since OAV has been proven to be harmless to the bees for well over 20 years, even when used every week for months, I just gave up on wasting my time. 
   Now... if I start to see evidence that OAV is harmful when used as directed, I might back off on the recommended treatments and start checking the mite loads, and treat only when it is necessary to avoid disaster.
   I do have hives of Waynes bees that I do not treat, and I do check them two to three times a year. 

  Does that make sense?
   It does to me, but I am Lazy when allowed to be!
   Scott

[Bakersdozen]

   Since OAV has been proven to be harmless to the bees for well over 20 years, even when used every week for months, I just gave up on wasting my time. 
 

  Does that make sense?
   
   Scott

You lost me.  What was wasting your time?  Treating for mites?

[riverbee]

what baker's said?  wasting time checking mite loads? and treating whether or not they need to be treated or as often maybe?

"i don't treat blindly...... 'treat because' .....or without 'evidence' of a mite problem.


   Ouch... shot through the heart!
    So let me explain my own philosophy?
   All bees have a mite problem unless your in Australia. Some of them have it worse than others.... Some of them are resistant and may not need to be treated. MOST of my hives do not have the resistance to cope with the mites, so I KNOW they will have problems if not treated."

scott, we all have different 'philosophies' and practices.  i spoke for my own beliefs and practices, and i guess 'philosophy'.

have you kept russian bees (from the rhba) and requeened with russian queens from the rhba? checked mite loads on these bees?  they are very mite resistant and very hygienic bees.

i do not treat my russian bees 'blindly'; i don't treat my bees 'because we are supposed to do it', or following some guideline or 'general practice' without knowledge, being 'observant', or 'aware' of my bees and what is going on in a hive.  that is my philosophy for these bees. i also have a philosophy for treatment of bees........... especially for new beeks that are struggling and trying to do the 'right thing'.  (won't get into that)

the majority of us do not keep russian bees. only you know your bees. only you know what you need to do, as all of those who are here.  each of us keep different genetics of bees in all sorts of conditions and we all do our best under all conditions/environments when it comes to mites. we just share what we do and why to help one another out.  i do believe that it is not good practice to just treat for mites because it's what we are supposed to do.
that's my philosophy, my thinking.

varroa mites have developed resistance to most treatments to the point some are useless, and/or we have to change up the treatments.
i would suspect in time oxalic acid may not work as well? i don't know.

[Bakersdozen]

varroa mites have developed resistance to most treatments to the point some are useless, and/or we have to change up the treatments.
i would suspect in time oxalic acid may not work as well? i don't know.

This has been a concern of mine as well.  Perhaps OA alternated with another mite control of choice. 

[LazyBkpr]

have you kept russian bees

   No. I intended to start and try them, but the sheer number of hives is now prohibitive in tat requeening them all with pure strains of resistant bees would be very expensive. I still by the less pure strains with resistance in the hopes that I am adding some resistance to my apiaries, as well as some feral colonies...  Maybe one day I can drop back to 40 or less hives and get pure queens.
   I assumed you were talking about your bees, but wanted to make sure you weren't using a politically correct method of slapping me!   


 Bakers;
   You lost me.  What was wasting your time?  Treating for mites?

   No, checking mite levels in nearly 100 hives. Sugar roll or alcohol wash or either roll etc... on that many hives would take me two or three days JUST to check them all individually.

varroa mites have developed resistance to most treatments to the point some are useless, and/or we have to change up the treatments.
i would suspect in time oxalic acid may not work as well? i don't know.

This has been a concern of mine as well.  Perhaps OA alternated with another mite control of choice. 

   As I understand it, mites that come into contact with OA Crystals DIE, so they do not get the opportunity to build any type of resistance. it is also my understanding that the method of kill is through soft tissue, around legs, mouth etc, so unless the mites can develop a means of locomotion without having soft tissue around their legs etc, they cannot become immune.
   Immunity is built in a few different ways, usually by sub lethal doses that do not kill the mites, kind of like one of us getting shots of bee venom to help build up our immunity to it.
   When the mites are killed when they come into contact, it does not allow an immunity to develop.
   OAV has been in use for a long time, as long or longer than most other insecticide types of treatments here in the states, and is still being used across the big pond with no apparent decrease in effectiveness. I feel it is safe to say that if the mites were going to develop immunity to OAV they would have done so long before now.    JUST.. my own conclusions and deductions.
   Scott

[Lburou]

I like the looks of that device.

We don't know how long oxalic acid will be effective, but it has been effective for  20+ years.  The 'new' method of treating shop towels with a long lasting oxalic acid solution that stays in the hive for weeks and weeks gives the mite a better chance to develop resistance, but time will tell.  I don't care for the 'dribble' method either, because you put more acid in the hive that way.

I will treat with OAV during a broodless period and whenever I see mite waste in empty cells (isn't very often).  Or, whenever I feel the need.  Haven't been doing mite counts every time.  But I don't treat much either. 

Our best tactic is to rotate treatments using something more than just oxalic acid.  Thymol treatments are pretty effective and should be part of the mix.  Formic acid works pretty well, but I haven't tried it yet...I need to learn more about it. These named Rx's are 'soft' treatments in an Integrated Pest Management regimen.  I do not EVER intend to use one of the 'hard' treatments in my hives, hope it never comes to that.  I'm moving back to BWeaver bees and hoping for the day I don't have to treat. 

[vvand111]

Thanks for that L.. I am new.  I have Wayne's bees in hive #1. I had a huge number of mites by sticky board count last august. I asked for relief but I had promised IDEE that I would not treat. I did not treat as I gave him my word.

Hive # 2 had as high a count and I decided to treat with OAV.  3 treatments before fall and 2 late in the fall.

# 1 has me so concerned because of so many bees early in this year that I am struggling to do the right thing but regardless of separate issues I have had sticky boards several times this spring including the last 3 days with absolutely no mites. SHB yes. only 4 today

Hive # 2 with 20% less bees, same except with no SHB.

I know that everyone says there is no way I do not have mites but I have no indication as to date.  More interesting is that I started my neighbor, 500 yards away from me, Last year. My # 2 and his only#1 are from the same source.  He and I did the OAV the same time together and he has no mites on his sticky board either.  We both had them but no sign of them now??

We continue to monitor on a regular basis.

No mites,  Thriving hives, unbelievable but true to date. You better believe we both keep our fingers crossed and continue the best practices we can learn, a lot of that comes from this sight.

Go figure?? but no sign of mites???  Wow

[riverbee]

lee, thanks i appreciated your insight and post.

thymol products do work well. i agree on 'changing it up'. ,

"have you kept russian bees
   No. I intended to start and try them, but the sheer number of hives is now prohibitive in tat requeening them all with pure strains of resistant bees would be very expensive. I still by the less pure strains with resistance in the hopes that I am adding some resistance to my apiaries, as well as some feral colonies...  Maybe one day I can drop back to 40 or less hives and get pure queens.
   I assumed you were talking about your bees, but wanted to make sure you weren't using a politically correct method of slapping me!    "


scott, yes they are expensive. (russian bees)  i don't keep the numbers of hives you do. even my small losses are expensive to 'replace'. (i purchase only nucs and replacement queens when available) i do my best at queen rearing from the hives/queens i obtain that do very well, most of them do. even if they are mutts of i don't care, as long as i have surviving hives that i am not losing and replacing every year.
this is not pure stock!

i was talking about my own bees, and when it comes to bees, there is no 'politically correct method'..........?............ ..........
dang not even sure what that means?  went way over my brain and college education...........

EDIT AND ADD:
vandy keep doing what you are doing, and check drone cells, if you have any mites they are there.  i get this all the time, 'no way i don't have mites'.
i stopped trying to explain that either i don't have mites or have a very low mite load.  it is possible, might not last for long.

[vvand111]

Thanks River.  All keep telling me I do ( have mites).  At this point it is the last of my concern because I have no evidence that I do.
 ( based on all of what every one tells me)

I am new and only have a few hives and other issues concern me.  Mostly this year too much honey, how to harvest or not to harvest this early in the year and because of weather how to keep these hives from swarming. I have just recently gone into my hives and harvested honey and replaced frames to hope that the queens have more room to lay and the hives can continue to prosper.

No mites or not I have other problems as a new guy sees it. ( 0 mite count after 4- 2 day sticky board trials over 2- weeks)

Some of the the same guys in this thread have given me advice. It is all appreciated and I continue to learn

I will continue to monitor mites , that is why I read this thread, I continue to say I have no measurable mite count.

We all have our own way of getting through it.

Thanks for your post

Vandy

[Bakersdozen]

 Bakers;
   You lost me.  What was wasting your time?  Treating for mites?

   No, checking mite levels in nearly 100 hives. Sugar roll or alcohol wash or either roll etc... on that many hives would take me two or three days JUST to check them all individually.

OK, Scott, now it makes sense.  Also, we are learning if you treat one you need to treat all colonies in an apiary.  Varroa Bombs I believe is the term used. 
As for Varroa never getting immune to OA...I have learned to be cautious about using the word never.  Nature finds a way to survive and Varroa is very adaptable.